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LC90 D4D Blown head gasket or cracked head

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mks
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:29    Post subject: LC90 D4D Blown head gasket or cracked head Reply with quote

Hi my LC90 is off the road. Blowing coolant out of the expansion tank. Take the radiator cap off, start the engine and it pumps fluid out at an alarming rate. The coolant looks like a pink smoothed and has the same consistency.  So definitely contaminated with oil. My wife normally drives the car and called me last night to say it wasnít driving as it should and then temp rose quite suddenly. She stopped the car as temp approached red. The only other symptom was a slight rough running during the week before, enough to notice but not really put down to anything specific.
From all the posts I have seen Iím guessing blown gasket or more likely a cracked head. Anyone got up to date info on replacement heads, any recommendations, I saw roughtrax and milners mentioned. Planning to do the work myself. Anyone got first hand knowledge of taking the head off and how long it takes. I have the Max Ellery manual.

BTW mine is the D4D engine


Martin
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:29    Post subject: Google Ads keep this community free to join!


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uk_vette
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:55    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a complete head, if you are interested, minus injectors and glow plugs.

Came out of an 2004 model. Done about 90,000 miles.
Bottom end destroyed, so I bought a complete engine.







I guess a good strip down and clean, lap the valves in and reset the shims.
Or fit your glow plugs and injectors and just put it on as it is.

vetts
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mks
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 12:39    Post subject: Re: LC90 D4D Blown head gasket or cracked head Reply with quote

mks wrote:
Hi my LC90 is off the road. Blowing coolant out of the expansion tank. Take the radiator cap off, start the engine and it pumps fluid out at an alarming rate. The coolant looks like a pink smoothed and has the same consistency. †So definitely contaminated with oil. My wife normally drives the car and called me last night to say it wasnít driving as it should and then temp rose quite suddenly. She stopped the car as temp approached red. The only other symptom was a slight rough running during the week before, enough to notice but not really put down to anything specific.
From all the posts I have seen Iím guessing blown gasket or more likely a cracked head. Anyone got up to date info on replacement heads, any recommendations, I saw roughtrax and milners mentioned. Planning to do the work myself. Anyone got first hand knowledge of taking the head off and how long it takes. I have the Max Ellery manual.

BTW mine is the D4D engine


Martin

So I have done a bit of research looking for bits and contacted Mr T for some prices.
Recommendations seem to be use a genuine Toyota head gasket, £47.50 + VAT and come in various thicknesses denoted by the number of holes. It seems you should use the same as that which you remove, seems sensible. I did see a lot of talk on here about this and someone, canít remember who, advocating using the thickest available. No issues with tolerance and more likely to absorb very minor flaws etc, seems like sensible thinking, will probably go with like for like though.

Cylinder Head bolts. Some of talk on here about reusing bolts that are still within tolerance but not recommended by most. New bolts for Mr T £8.84+VAT each and you need 18 of them. Milners list a set for the 1KD-FTV as being in stock at I think £45 per set, and I see from here folks have used them without issues. Unfortunately they are out of stock and canít be supplied any more 
Toyota red coolant. Everyone is raving about it. Can anyone tell me what is better about this stuff than other good quality antifreeze? Just curious. Would rather err on the safe side but just curious to know the logic.
Next to my Max Ellery manual, well it doesnít cover the 1KD-FTV engine, so I donít have any original data for head bolt torques and sequences. Anyone have the data or know where I can find it?
Is there a manual available that covers the 1KD-FTV engine?
Having searched extensively for head gasket/head problems on this site, it all seems to relate to the 1KZ-TE engines.
Has anyone else seen issues with the 1KD-FTV series?
Having read Bob Murphyís post on his experiences with his new Roughtrax head and associated posts, I do wonder whether there is a simpler explanation. There was a great deal about air in the system and blowing out of the expansion tank etc.
BTW Bob if you are listening in, I saw from your posts that things seemed to have settled down with your new head etc. Just wondered as I was looking at AMC heads, which is what Roughtrax sell. While they donít  list one for my engine, AMC do make one, which Roughtrax are looking into for me.also uk-vette head a head so i'm leaning to going down that route if it does turn out that I need one.

Just like to say what a great site and source of information this site is and how helpful you folks are.


Martin
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mks
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 13:59    Post subject: Re: LC90 D4D Blown head gasket or cracked head Reply with quote

mks wrote:
Hi my LC90 is off the road. Blowing coolant out of the expansion tank. Take the radiator cap off, start the engine and it pumps fluid out at an alarming rate. The coolant looks like a pink smoothed and has the same consistency. †So definitely contaminated with oil. My wife normally drives the car and called me last night to say it wasnít driving as it should and then temp rose quite suddenly. She stopped the car as temp approached red. The only other symptom was a slight rough running during the week before, enough to notice but not really put down to anything specific.
From all the posts I have seen Iím guessing blown gasket or more likely a cracked head. Anyone got up to date info on replacement heads, any recommendations, I saw roughtrax and milners mentioned. Planning to do the work myself. Anyone got first hand knowledge of taking the head off and how long it takes. I have the Max Ellery manual.

BTW mine is the D4D engine


Martin

Now this is embarrassing, after all that searching around, thought I would go and check out the truck. The coolant is like pink milkshake, couldnít really see that in the dark during the weekÖÖ.and so is the tranny fluid. So it looks like I donít have a head problem after all but the dreaded radiator failure.

So Iím going to get the truck over the pit and drain the autobox and get the rad out.

So my new question is, what are the options for the radiator?
Mr T
Milners
Re core
Any others?

Iím guessing that whatever it is I need to do it sooner rather than later
Am think I should really take the auto sump off to get the most out, what do people think?

Iím thinking that this has only just happened so Iím hoping I have caught it early enough to avoid serious problems with the auto box. Fingers crossed.
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mickey5
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 23:14    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was quite shocked at first when you mentioned your head cracking and it being the D4D engine, as this has never happend before, or I have never heard of it. It is a common problem on the 1kzte engines thought.

And your problem seems to be the radiator failing and leaking into the autobox, which has made it mix, but then I am still unsure to why coolant is being pressurised out?????  Shocked  

Anyway, I would recommend you get a new rad, and flush your autobox a few times until it runs clear. Then see what happens. I got my rad from Milners and its been fine for over 3 years now.
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mks
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 1:02    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, not sure why it should pressurise, but I plan to do the new radiator and autobox flush. Drained both today. Very gooey as it is so cold. Will try the milners route for the radiator. Not only is the Mr T radiator about £550 the earliest availability is 11/12. None in the UK apparently.

I did a bit of checking on ATF as I reckon I'm going to need a fair bit. Dexron 3 is available from Smith and Allan at £60 for 20 litres, seems like the best deal so far

Martrin
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benterrier
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 10:56    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi MKS
Your symptoms of pressure in the system probably point to a blown head gasket as a result of atf oil and water mixing. This emulsion mix blocking the cooling system somewhere.
Your wife's indication of rough running and ultimately sharp temperature rise indicate the stage of events.

Before removing old rad disconnect the atf pipes from rad and loop them  and check for fluid draining out continually from the rad atf connections. Next start the engine with the cooling system full and check the pressurising of the system, now you should see a increased leak coming out of the atf  connections on bottom of rad if the cooling coil has failed. If so do the head gasket next. This way you won't get as much emulsion *beep* in your new radiator.

regards
Benterrier
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mks
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 14:02    Post subject: Reply with quote

benterrier wrote:
Hi MKS
Your symptoms of pressure in the system probably point to a blown head gasket as a result of atf oil and water mixing. This emulsion mix blocking the cooling system somewhere.
Your wife's indication of rough running and ultimately sharp temperature rise indicate the stage of events.

Before removing old rad disconnect the atf pipes from rad and loop them †and check for fluid draining out continually from the rad atf connections. Next start the engine with the cooling system full and check the pressurising of the system, now you should see a increased leak coming out of the atf †connections on bottom of rad if the cooling coil has failed. If so do the head gasket next. This way you won't get as much emulsion *beep* in your new radiator.

regards
Benterrier

Hi Benterrier, Thanks for the tips, I was hoping that I wouldnít now have the blown gasket as well, but I rather thing you may be right.

I like your idea of bypassing the bottom of the rad as a test. Iíll do that. If the leak from the autobox connections is excessive, I was also thinking of putting a pipe between the two. This would allow me the run the engine for a while to flush the system. I may also take out the thermostat to do that.
I could even run the car like that for a while but there would be no cooling on the autobox side. That got me wondering, I suppose running the atf fluid through the radiator might be acting as both a cooler and heater, helping to bring the auto fluid up the running temp. Donít know if this would be the case or note.
Anyone got any thoughts on running with the atf cooling bypassed, is this a definite no no.
Also while the atf pipes are off I plan to flush through the auto box following some tips I found on U tube. The sequence goes as follows.
Drain the transmission.
Disconnect the atf hoses
Blow through the return to send any gunge into the sump
Allow to drain
Top up with new fluid
Run the engine while continuing to top up the box
This pumps the old fluid out of the torque converter etc.
Stop when it runs clean.
Iím guessing Iíll probably have to do this a few times.
Now as this is a right royal pain Iím wondering whether I should fit a completely separate oil cooler for the auto transmissionÖ.

Martin
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Lloydy
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 23:31    Post subject: Reply with quote

Having oil in the coolant will alter the boiling point of the coolant, and coat the surface of the radiator adding to the problem, as does the thick emulsified sludge as it probably goes slower through the small passages in the radiator.

I would sort the radiator and hopefully save the tranny before removing the head, it might not need it. I have flushed cooling systems contaminated with oil using Jizer before now, and it cleaned all the emulsified oil out very successfully.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:09    Post subject: Reply with quote

This happend to my 1KZ-TE. I flushed the coolant by disconnecting the return hose, and using the autobox pump to push it out, and topping up. I did about 2 litres at a time as I didn't want to run the box dry. It took just over 20 litres to be perfect, and now the box changes better than ever.

Depending on how long there was coolant in the ATF, there may be some damage to the autobox clutch, but you won't know unless you open it. I decided to just drive it and if the problems manifest I will deal with them then, but after about 5k it is still shifting sweet as!
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mks
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 13:46    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lloydy and Fridayman, thanks for the tips
New Radiator ordered from Advanced Radiators, I saw a few posts that recommended them, should arrive tomorrow.
40 Litres of Dexron 3 ordered from Smith and Allan should also arrive tomorrow. They were very helpful and the cheapest around for bulk buys
Still need to decide on the coolant, Toyota red or best quality ethylene Glycol, anyone know a cheap suppler of Toyota red which everyone swears by.

Will try the Jizer route to flush the cooling.
Unfortunately Iím going to have to do that with the new rad as the old one is now leaking like a sieve. As I took the ATF hoses off, the elbow on the nearside of the rad came off in my hand. The elbow was OK but what it was screwed into, should have been a thread, had turned to mush. Iím amazed it hadnít been blown off by the pressure build up.
I have some pictures if I get time and can remember how to post them, I will.
So a warning to other owners. Might just be worth giving those connections a quick tweek. Might give you early warning of failure, better they let go in a controlled manner.
I would be tempted to have a custom rad made in stainless for that bottom piece. No idea if anyone does that or if it is possible.
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benterrier
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 13:52    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would be great if you could take a pic of the offending oil cooler in the bottom of the radiator!
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mks
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 14:49    Post subject: Reply with quote

benterrier wrote:
Would be great if you could take a pic of the offending oil cooler in the bottom of the radiator!

I do have some but I'll get a better shot with macro lens once the radiator is off.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 15:12    Post subject: Reply with quote

mks wrote:
Still need to decide on the coolant, Toyota red or best quality ethylene Glycol, anyone know a cheap suppler of Toyota red which everyone swears by.

As I took the ATF hoses off, the elbow on the nearside of the rad came off in my hand. The elbow was OK but what it was screwed into, should have been a thread, had turned to mush. Iím amazed it hadnít been blown off by the pressure build up.


I had exactly the same thing happen!

The better coolants are supposed to be better at slowing the aluminium corrosion, but as to what is better... can of worms. I went with toyo pink, but only because there was a group buy.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 15:57    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've always used the halfords 5 year pink stuff, never had any problems with any of my Surfs or Landcruisers.
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