The Toyota Landcruiser Owners Club

thor · Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 12:16 Post subject: Jump Start

I am getting ready to duck..... Embarassed

Just had a thought......If I was to attach a set of jump leads, to start someones vehicle, would I, connect on one battery or connect on alternative connections on both batteries. or what???? Confused

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garystockton · Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 12:26 Post subject:

IIRC there's a section in the owner's manual on this - and I don't remember what they said Embarassed

so if anyone's got an owners manual nearby, can you let us know?? Otherwise I'll check tonight Laughing

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Landcrusher · Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 13:36 Post subject:

No, what you don't want to do is end up with the batteries in series and send 24v to the other vehicle. Jump using the main battery. It is in the manual yes. On a UK vehicle, looking at the engine from the front, the master battery is on the left. This gives a direct connection to the alternator and maximum juice.

LC
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garystockton · Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 13:44 Post subject:

Landcrusher · Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 13:53 Post subject:

Odd, mine was the other way around I'm sure Gary. It doesn't matter much as either way is safe. Just don't connect across the two! On the 90 (which is virtually the same mechanicals and running gear, it's on the left. The SWB only has one and it's definitely on the left.

Any hoo, you have one in front of you and I don't. Unless you reversed the image Ha Ha.

LC
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garystockton · Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 14:01 Post subject:

Ja - and I reversed the inter-cooler cover too Wink

Anyway, yes, you're right, choose either battery, but only one!!
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I'll be more enthusiastic about encouraging thinking outside the box when there's evidence of any thinking going on inside it.
- Terry Pratchett

Nuclear Chicken · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 12:30 Post subject:

Both barreries are paralleled so there is no 'master'. As Gery says, use pos/neg from one battery only to avoid the possibility of getting a 24V jump. Highly improbable but no point putting anything to chance.
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Landcrusher · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 17:57 Post subject:

I think you'll find that one battery is fed by the alternator and the other is 'slaved' in parallel to it. In effect this makes one the 'master' battery. For starting they're the same but for direct charging they are not. A winch for example would go to the alternator being fed directly by the alternator. Connecting to a cable coming from the main battery is not the same as connecting to the battery post itself. I have tried that myself. Can't explain the electrickery involved, but it would not power my winch properly. Had to connect straight to the terminals of the battery.

Or put it another way. If you undid the terminals of the second battery it would have no overall effect. Disconnect the master battery and you'd have all sorts of things not working.

LC
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HDJ 80 but still a 90 owner at heart (yeah right!)

Crispin · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 18:00 Post subject:

garystockton · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 19:55 Post subject:

Only the 80 series were 24v start, IIRC. The 120 is fully 12v, but there is so much electrical draw from all teh electrickery on-board that 2 batteries were chucked in - called 'handed batteries' because they mirror each other. Funnily enough, Halfords do have them Laughing

RTFM

Think it's great that they've done that - but it does mean no room under the bonnet for an auxilliary battery for the fridge / freezer, so that'll have to go in the back somewhere. I was going to get a Blue-Top Optima battery because it's sealed and can be mounted in any position, but after the slating they've been getting on ELCO and other places I'm no longer so sure.

The search continues ...
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I'll be more enthusiastic about encouraging thinking outside the box when there's evidence of any thinking going on inside it.
- Terry Pratchett

garystockton · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 20:17 Post subject:

The 120 manual )page 330) has a whole bunch of gumph about jump-starting, but it's what you'd find in any vehicle user-guide I think, except for one bit:

"The battery used for boosting must be 12V. Do not jump start unless you are sure that the booster battery is correct." This obviously applies in this wording as if the 120 is the receiving vehicle - I guess it applies just as well for the recipient vehicle Wink

Nothing is mentioned about which battery to use to jump start someone else, or to receive a boost.

It also has a picture showing that you should attache the negative cable to a point on or just behind the power steering fluid reservoir.
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I'll be more enthusiastic about encouraging thinking outside the box when there's evidence of any thinking going on inside it.
- Terry Pratchett

Crispin · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 20:18 Post subject:

ha, so I was right. I'm pretty sure I saw people talking about the 120 and 24v. Could be wrong though. (Probably)

If you want a battery pack why not look into a li-ion flat pack? Could be hidden in a rear panel somewhere, charged of the main batteries but used as it's one source.
li-ion or li-po are very high density but very light. (Li-Po's tend to explode though if charged wrongly Confused

)

Just a thought...
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garystockton · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 20:52 Post subject:

Hmmm - would it run a 12v National Luna 52 litre Weekender freezer? Where can I get details?? And what's the cost????
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I'll be more enthusiastic about encouraging thinking outside the box when there's evidence of any thinking going on inside it.
- Terry Pratchett

Crispin · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 22:21 Post subject:

slight thread hijack - apologies.

I was thinking more along the lines of making your own pack. They more expensive than normal Pb batteries but they are lighter and far more compact than Pb.
What I have done in the past is to buy individual cells off fleabay or any other site selling them and make up your own pack.
You could buy pre-made ones like these http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=1005

Would it run your fridge? Yes. For how long depends on how large you make the pack. A typical Pb battery is 50-70Ah rating.
The above is then pretty expensive to match that. A 40AH pack would set you back $850 Confused

Double it....
The spec on your fridge is 1.2-2.2A. So a 40AH pack would last 50/2A=25H. Less with various losses etc. Even a 7AH Pb "alarm" batter would keep the fridge ticking over for a couple hours. Those are small and light. Fit them into the bumper? Surprised

Pb is still much cheaper option. Li-Ion also needs a "special" charger for it. You cannot just charge 'em.
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Crispin
Have Snorkel, Will Swim

thor · Posted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 10:29 Post subject:

So it was not such a dumb question after all then....now I am surprised Shocked

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'They're coming to take me away..ha..ha'

Land Cruiser LC3 D-4D Auto 2002
General Grabbers At2
Shovel